‘Bonhoeffer: Pastor. Spy. Assassin’: An Interview with Producer John Scanlon 

The highly anticipated film Bonhoeffer: Pastor. Spy. Assassin hits theaters on November 22 through Angel Studios. The biopic explores the inspirational and morally complex life of Dietrich Bonhoeffer, a German pastor and passivist turned political spy and assassin. Set against the rise of Adolf Hitler and Nazism, the film showcases Bonhoeffer’s moral courage as he stands firm in the truth of Jesus.   

We sat down to chat with producer John Scanlon, who has been working for more than 12 years to have this film made. In the interview, he talks about Bonhoeffer’s inspirational faith, the challenges of making a movie that features such complex subject matter, the importance of historical accuracy and authenticity, and how he hopes the film will resonate with audiences today.   

(Note: This interview has been edited for length and clarity. Watch the full conversation above.)     

Daniel Blackaby: What attracted you to the story of Bonhoeffer? 

John Scanlon: I think anybody who’s read Bonhoeffer’s writings or biographies of Bonhoeffer is inspired by his story. He’s a man very much of his time, but someone who was really committed to living out his faith. He was a passionate follower of Jesus. He had a wonderful encounter with Jesus in Harlem in the United States and then came back to Germany in the middle of World War Two and realized that there were lessons he could apply from that experience to witness in Germany as it’s engulfed in Nazism. It’s an exciting story. It’s a story where the stakes couldn’t be higher.  

DB: He’s a fascinating individual. He’s also a complicated one. I don’t know many historical figures that can have both the words “pastor” and “assassin” in the title of their biopic! Were there any challenges in telling a story with some complex moral gray areas? 

JS: Absolutely. In cinema, the heart of any drama is conflict. Two people want different things. They fight, one wins, it’s that sort of thing. And it’s true in the lives of believers as well. We all grow through meeting challenges we think are impossible obstacles and then God finds a way around them.  

The problem with a figure like Bonhoeffer is you’re tempted to make it a hagiography, just a sort of saint story where everything works out perfectly. They’re great people at the beginning of the story, they triumph over adversity, and they’re great people at the end. But Bonhoeffer adapts, he overcomes, he’s always on the move, he’s always confronting challenges. So, from a storytelling perspective, the cinema version of Bonhoeffer that we’re presenting is a very exciting film character.  

The idea was to create an exciting cinematic portrayal that was true, beautiful, good, and excellent art, which I think this film really is. Some of the biggest obstacles around the film were coming up with the right way to tell the story so that it didn’t come off as dry and academic. We went through several teams of screenwriters over the years. We met with several potential distribution partners. We dodged a lot of bullets. We almost started production right before COVID, which would have been a disaster. So, the timing, although it’s been a long journey, has really worked in our favor. We see God’s hand behind everything that’s happened around this project. 

DB: How would you describe Bonhoeffer’s faith?  

JS: He was very rigorous and academic about his faith in the beginning. He became a credentialed theologian at a very young age. He wound up in New York City at Union Theological Seminary in Manhattan as a very young scholar, a star representative of the German church. And as you’ll see in the film, he fell in with a different kind of crowd, a crowd that may not be as theologically schooled as he was but had a different connection with Jesus that really called to him and drew him in. And it was that experience that really lit a fire under him and sent him back to Germany with a mission. He was passionately committed to following Jesus. 

He was always listening, always attentive. He was unforgiving of himself and very self-disciplined and radical in his commitment to discipleship and to faith. And that cost him, because he saw those things being attacked and undermined in the Germany of his day. So, there was a lot of heartbreak for him along the way and a lot of disappointment, but ultimately there was triumph. 

DB: This film looks spectacular. It definitely helps to have someone like John Matheson as the cinematographer, and you also filmed on location in Belgium and Ireland. How much of a priority was it to really capture authentically the look and the atmosphere of that time period?  

JS: Oh, it was absolutely essential. Commitment to the period, commitment to the types of actors who would come across as most authentic. Most of the actors in the film who are playing anti-Nazi Germans are German. So, there are people with a deep sense of connection to this story.  

Everybody’s killing it and bringing their A game. The acting is phenomenal. The music is amazing. It’s just a very high-level film, especially given the subject matter. 

DB: Was there a specific moment or scene that is particularly memorable for you? 

JS: The scene that comes to mind is the scene that we shot in a church in Ireland where Bonhoeffer is giving one of his great sermons. In some ways, it’s the hinge of the film. You don’t think of sermons as necessarily being all that exciting, but this one is really inspiring. We had actor Jonas Dasser in the pulpit, and he’s doing an amazing, mesmerizing job. And when he got through the first iteration of the key part of the sermon, everyone on the set—all the extras, the cameraman, the lighting, all of us behind the scenes—gave an ovation. It was irresistible. It was this magical moment where I think everyone got what this film was about and got the level on which it was operating. It was an ovation for an amazing performance, but also an ovation of, “We’re so glad to be here and to be a part of this.” Just a tremendous moment.  

DB: There are things in this story that reflect what we experience today, whether the threat of nationalism in the church, or political violence, or charismatic leaders. Different contexts, but a lot of similarities. As a producer of this movie, in what ways do you think that this film—and Bonhoeffer’s life in general—can resonate with audiences today? 

JS: Let me say first that we did not set out to make a message movie. It was 2012/2013 when we kicked things off. We thought we’d wrap in a couple of years and this film would be in theaters in 2014 or 2015. And every year along the way, we thought next year will be the year it comes out. It’s really the Lord’s timing that it is coming out this year. So, nothing about our film is designed to send a message.  

But I think this is a film about its own era and a film about the era that it’s seen in. There is an eternal struggle taking place on screen where you have a man of faith who’s totally committed to the Lord, but he is confronted with impossible choices. Some of those are political, some are personal, and some are cultural. I think there’s an aspect of, “What do we as Christians do in living out our faith in this world and these very trying circumstances domestically and internationally?” I think we can find a voice, a vision and a role model in the Bonhoeffer film. 

But again, that was never our intention. We didn’t make this film as a tutorial on how to survive tumultuous political times. But I think you’ll come out of the theater entertained and inspired, maybe with a different way of thinking about how you engage with politics and culture. I think there’s plenty of meat there for anybody who’s serious about engaging.  

DB: Thank you so much, John. It was just a pleasure. 

JS: Thank you, Daniel. Appreciate the time.